BobDylan

Thanks mac, you said it all, way better than I would, in replying to V.'s comment. We are in fascism already here in the US, even if the corporate media and the Dem Party won't use the F-word. Renee Good's murder officially sealed it, along with the coverup that began immediately afterwards and the clear picture that Jonathan Ross is going to completely get away with it, along with THE LYIN' KING and Noem.. And none of the progress of the sixties, such as civil rights, ending the Vietnam War, or the passing of the Great Society programs like Medicaid and Medicare, as well as the anti poverty programs, would have happened if we had only had MLK and peaceful protestors, etc.. Without the Panthers, the SDS and the Weathermen, waging radical civil war against the feds, the powers that be would never have made those concessions that I listed above, to the masses here. The sad thing is, as mac pointed out, that radicals of both types of movements, peaceful and violent, end up usually being either murdered, imprisoned or exiled by the state, rather than being rewarded, honored, or allowed to actually gain or hold power in the government.. So I stand by my point, we need more radicals like the Black Panthers, not less, and as long as they aren't committing violence against innocent people, who are not acting corruptly against the rights of the people, like shooting peaceful protestors or committing racist violence against minorities, I am fine with them fighting back for us.. Because the cops and the Dems sure as hell aren't going to fight for us or protect us against these fascists. The irony is that saying these kind of obvious truths would get me banned on reddit, a supposedly left-leaning site, yet owned by a right wing billionaire oligarch, so no surprise that reddit ends up being no more tolerant or open-minded about political dissension than Facebook. I hope that this site does better by us than those two have so far, under THE LYIN' KING rule... And as far as the Dem Party, what needs fixed is not their messaging, but their policies, esp. on economics, foreign policy, and civil liberties, where they are mainly Repub lite, as well as their actions, esp. when they are in power in DC. Like not delivering on much of their campaign promises. THE LYIN' KING and the Repubs can get away with doing that, because no one outside of their cult ever believes them anyway on their promises, but the Dems will always be held to a higher standard. Time to accept that and start earning the trust and loyalty of the voters, instead of running completely on how bad THE LYIN' KING is and "at least we aren't the Repubs"... All the Repub and MAGA voters care about, is THE LYIN' KING hurting and hating on the same people they hate, not him delivering on his campaign promises. Until he starts actually hurting them, they won't ever wake up or turn on him, much less start caring about the people they hate being hurt..

Funny how the comedians tell the most truth these days of anybody, when it comes to the controversial stuff..

It is closed and clearly murder, unless of course you're part of MAGA, then you must deny your own eyes, make excuses for the murderer, and blame the victim... Anyone that sides with the shooter, is telling you everything you need to know about their character and values, and you should shun them like the devil... These people would have been making excuses for and supporting the Nazis in Germany, and cheering on the Gestapo back then, same way they support our modern American version of them..

The Repubs have been out to eliminate public broadcasting for decades, finally got their wish... Gotta keep those peasants ignorant, and keep all media in the private sector, where it can be just as easily controlled and censored, in fact more so here in America, than by the government...

That and the new video that came out today, where he shoots her dead and then mutters "🍆>🐱ing bitch", gives away his whole murderous attitude, rather than him reacting in fear or feeling traumatized, etc.. The hard fact is, he was holding his cell phone in one hand and his gun in the other, and he was lowering his phone in one hand as he was reaching for his gun, before shooting her. What all that tells me is, he made his decision a couple seconds before she began moving her car, that he was going to shoot her dead and also record it on his phone, because she had butt hurt his pride by not meekly submitting quickly enough to his bullying authority, and the other woman on the street, who told him to "go have some lunch, big boy", had lipped off to him about his bull💩, bullying behavior, so he had to get even and teach her a lesson, in front of others and make an example of someone, all to restore his macho pride. He should be convicted of at least second degree murder and rot in prison, but he never will..

I agree that we need something like the Panthers these days, as it would scare the 💩 out of MAGA and ICE. Only this time, hopefully the feds, cops, and FBI wouldn't be able to massacre and crush them.. and these days, the "radical left" and any "leftist threat" is simply more MAGA lies, propaganda, and figments of their imagination, at best. But mostly the first two of the three... The right has revolutionaries, who have succeeded thru a political coup. The left needs revolutionaries too now, tho our side is unlikely to ever win thru electoral politics, because money is way too powerful in that arena these days, compared to the 1960s...

I think you're right. As Malcom X said long ago, " America respects violence, it was founded on violence. I think it's the only thing it respects". Whether you agree with that or not, it's clear that violence, or at least physical force, is the only thing that fascists like THE LYIN' KING and his supporters and cronies respect... And yes, I remember that couple, and it made me think it's not a bad idea for peaceful protestors to have a couple of armed guards or security people at their protests, at least if there are no cops on duty around them to be able to protect them against nuts like that couple..

I would add a fourth demand to your list of three, V. And that is for ICE to finally be reined in, with them having to follow the same laws as other law enforcement officers, including no more being masked, badgeless and without names and numbers on their uniforms. And also no more sending ICE to only blue states and blue cities, all designed to target and create violence in those places. ICE should be returned to its former practices, before THE LYIN' KING got into power again. That should be an iron demand.. If they won't agree to that, then the Dems and any Repubs in congress who still have a conscience, should cut all funding to ICE and DHS immediately...

I share your anger, despair and frustration, Amanda. I really don't know what else to say. Thanks for your comment..

I really wish that were true, but the rest of the world knows THE LYIN' KING is nuts, and so are some of his inner circle, while our country is a superpower with nukes, so I seriously doubt any other country will save us from him. Best chance is either him dying of natural causes, or the very unlikely chance of another country successfully whacking him thru assassination... Iran would be my best guess for that, and THE LYIN' KING's admin. is surely keeping an eye out for that...

Exactly, it's completely bull💩 and frustrating, when one side has to practice complete restraint, while the other is able to be completely lawless and restrained in its cruelty and brutality. They want civil war and are already waging it, on their side. Meanwhile, the Dems offer no real unified leadership with any actions that would ever be effective against the regime and its oligarch backers. Instead they wring their hands, lecture about morality, and make empty gestures.. And then wonder why most of the public has no real respect for them nor sees them as any real opposition party that can or will fight the Repubs and THE LYIN' KING.. The Dems just tell people to trust them, wait for the midterms, and have faith that the midterms will happen and be run fairly. Well, most people have given up hope on any of that happening or even being effective in stopping THE LYIN' KING and the Repubs. They want to hear about organized boycotts against his oligarch backers, and organized, targeted actions that will actually scare or force Repubs into abandoning THE LYIN' KING, and bring some relief sooner, rather than later, from the domestic terrorism of ICE, such as refusing to fund DHS, same with funding the Venezuala takeover... More Americans are going to start arming themselves, on our side, and preparing themselves to shoot it and defend themselves against ICE, rather than wait on our system causing ICE to back off and stop terrorizing people. Because we all know the cops are not going to protect us against them, or they would have started taking our side and standing up for us months ago... And for that, I blame our blue state governors for not drawing a line months ago and ordering the arrest of ICE goons that started going masked, badgeless and without names or numbers on their uniforms. This would have stopped or deterred this long ago, but those governors didn't want to risk that being seen as a provocation of civil war. Well, when even white citizens are no longer safe from being murdered by ICE, even if they are unarmed and not a threat, then what do we have left to lose or protect by not having our cops stand up to these 🍆s? Somebody explain that to me....

"Hard to believe he is alive", esp. after he walked all the way down to her car and back, after he murdered her, and then was whisked away, not to any hospital, but to prevent him from being identified, questioned, or arrested by local cops. And of course, we will never get any medical reports about him made public, all because the feds will claim it's to "protect his privacy".... He will get away scot free from this, the same way Chauvin thought he would with murdering George Floyd...

I agree with anyone who says that shaming will still work a lot of the time, even these days, but only on ordinary people who do not possess great wealth or power. But those who have one or both of those things, are now immune from feeling shame or really suffering much from being publicly shamed. I did some thinking about our present dilemma, and one other strategy did come to mind, related to this. And that would be large, ongoing public protests directly outside the homes of the shameless public officials and pols, putting the heat on them and their neighbors for their corrupt policies and actions. But that tactic is much more risky than targeted boycotts, because most of them will have security details, either privately hired, or publicly funded, as well as usually having the local cops on their side. So the protestors risk being arrested, jailed, or even shot for their involvement. And unlike the civil rights and anti war movement during Vietnam, the courts are much more right wing and supportive of cracking down on protestors, unless they are right wing protestors. So the only hope with that tactic, would be supplying lawyers, free of charge, for any protestor arrested, and then going for jury nullification after seeking a jury trial for each protestor. Lots of risk all around for the protest movement...

Like they said back in the Watergate scandal era, and still just as always true, "Always follow the money.".......

The Repub Party these days, not just THE LYIN' KING, are utterly shameless, and they also usually suffer no consequences for their behavior, so of course as long as that continues, the general public will also mostly choose to go in that same direction, as far as behavior. The same applies to the ultra rich and corporations, also shameless, and rarely suffering consequences for their behavior and actions. More shaming and more equal justice and fair equal treatment under the law, is the only way any of this changes. Even elections will not change the behavior of the Repubs in politics, I fear, as they have decided they can always just cheat their way to winning elections, no matter what the voters want, if elections are even held in the future... My fear of either civil war or permanent dictatorship, without any real future elections, gets worse every day... It's starting to look like civil war may be our only way out of this, but I know our side is never going to agree to wage one against the right wingers.. The other way to overthrow them is general strikes, but those also are never going to happen, because too many working age Americans have their healthcare tied to their jobs, and are living paycheck to paycheck, so boycotts against the worst corporations are probably our best bet for fighting back against our corrupt govt.. Attack their financial backers, and put the pressure on them that way...

Yeah, it's now official and indisputeable, our national govt. is now a rogue nation.... Untrustworthy and hated by most of the world. THE LYIN' KING has now gotten his wish, to be our version of Putin, his idol..

I respect your stand of favoring animals over humans in the Darwinian scheme of things. I don't bet or gamble on things, but if I did, my money too, would be on the animal over the human, in any bare knuckles brawl...

As for prioritizing life forms, I always root for the higher life form in the process of evolution, thus favoring cockroaches over homo sapiens of the THE LYIN' KING and Stephen Miller variety...

No thanks, mac, I'll pass on the boiling water, lol... I've already engaged in enough masochism so far in the dating game, that I don't need to add the boiling water...

Trust me, scary, you will love retirement, not only with the free time it will bring, but more greatly the freedom to say exactly what you think, for the most part with most people. If you're financially secure and comfortable, all you need to enjoy it is your health, a decent social circle, and several interests, which for people like us is easy, as we are already fairly independent and intellectually curious, so we naturally find ways to fill our time after retiring, even if we have to do it mostly without companionship. That last thing is really the only thing I'm lacking in my life, so it follows that my interest in the dating game is more serious than most women my age, who are already mostly fulfilled emotionally and socially with their adult kids and grandkids, neither of which I have.. If being vegan is a line in the sand for being partnered, I can and will respect that in the dating game, tho I've rarely run across it in my local dating pool, living in Iowa which is a farming state with almost everybody being a carnivore and lots of meatpacking plants and livestock operations, etc.. But if it isn't a line in the sand for a woman, I'm fine with compromising and each of us providing and eating whatever we want. Obviously that wouldn't work with a female version of mac, lol... But I do have my own lines in the sand on politics and religion, regarding dating, as I won't waste my time or a woman's, with dating a Libertarian, conservative, or Trumper. Same with someone whose religion and beliefs are fundamentalist, conservative, or very strongly religious, as it just wouldn't work.. And I do feel your pain about co-workers, as my last job before retirement, was chock full of co workers that were conservative Christians and Repubs... They also were very bigoted towards queer folk and not very smart or educated. It was a lot of tongue biting on my part..

Fair enough, I appreciate your honesty. I doubt we will ever meet in person, much less ever dine together. But I hope you'll still respect and like me as a person, regardless of my eating habits, as I am way more moral and ethical than most people, in every other way. You can't have everything in everybody, lol.. But your reaction here may explain why diet is a dealbreaker for some liberal women with me, after the issue comes up, even if we were compatible in every other way. Something for me to be aware of, in the dating game, even tho my profile says nothing about that issue and I seldom see it in any women's dating profiles. Maybe it's something that should be included in all dating profiles, same as religion and politics.. Same as I can't stand hearing country music and would never be comfortable dating someone who was a daily cig smoker... We all have our standards and preferences, the only thing that matters, is that we be honest and open about them with people we encounter in the dating game, and it's also healthy that said standards and preferences be realistic for what we ourselves bring to the table, or have to offer a partner. Otherwise, we are just bringing grief to ourselves and others in the dating game.. I too am retired, and am also rather choosy about who I keep company with. In fact, there are probably only a handful of people at my local senior center that I ever choose to sit with and talk with, since all the rest of them have nothing really in common with me, besides being 60 or older, living in my town and coming to that center to eat. Like you, I'm too old to put up with bull💩 or volunteer for conflict and irritation by engaging with people that are on another planet, for all practical purposes, in education level, intelligence, politics, culture, and religious beliefs. So if nobody that I already know and like is available to sit with, I gladly sit alone there. Better than the flack and friction of engaging with strangers who may as well be from a foreign country speaking another language.. Hopefully, you'll still see me as someone better and different than those first three groups of deplorables that you mentioned.,. Probably 90% of the population of my state, Iowa, are carnivores, yet a good 40% of them vote for Dems and are not members of your three groups of deplorables, so categorizing them that way for one practice seems a bit reductive and overly simplistic..

I am a carnivore, but I too try to just go with the flow and let others eat what they want. All I ask or need is a compromise where we go out to eat somewhere that has one thing on the menu I want and like. As for eating at home, I don't expect anyone to cook for me, and I don't cook, so we can each eat what we like, even if I have to bring my own food. It doesn't have to be a conflict or difference like smokers and non smokers, where that is something that does affect the other person's health, if the smoker smokes in the same room as them. And for me, dating a daily smoker is a dealbreaker in dating, as I don't enjoy kissing someone who's mouth smells like an ashtray, lol.. Altho I've heard from singer Natalie Merchant, a musician and vegetarian, that she said kissing a meat eater felt equally gross to her. So I guess for some, eating and smoking habits can be equal dealbreakers in dating, depending on how extreme either person is in their preferences..

As for social networks and social media, and having to watch what you say to not make others uncomfortable, I'm already seeing some posters on Substack, who are no longer going to be posting articles or essays, at least not under their own name, out of fear that they will be targeted by the feds, FBI, DOJ, or DHS, for being critical or dissenting from the THE LYIN' KING MAGA party line. To me, that is a very chilling sign, same as the likelihood that FB has or will be banning anyone who is too critical of THE LYIN' KING and the Repubs. So posting and commenting on the net may become very risky or costly. The whole thing of people starting to go underground or anonymous in their online comments regarding THE LYIN' KING and MAGA, seems way too much like the bad part of the 1960s, when many young people started to go underground to avoid detection and persecution from the feds, over their involvement in radical anti war or civil rights groups. They even became an organized group, The Weather Underground.... Like then, we need to be aware and vigilant about the same infiltration methods being used by the feds to undermine and go after members of our side. But this time, their survelliance methods are far more advanced and insidious..

I can only speak for myself, V., but on my FB page, where I share with my friends, as well as when I communicate with my siblings, who are my only family still left, I say whatever I want to, and if it makes any of them uncomfortable, too bad... They've long ago gotten used to it from me, lol....

Great comments, mac, and thanks for the two references you provided, the link to the article and the study you cited. Not surprised that the only messaging that might work on conservative leaning subjects, were health benefits and taste of plant-based meat products, and even then, I bet the taste would still be a hard sell to lifelong conservative meat eaters. My only experience with something like that, personally, is my quitting drinking alcohol in 1995, and never really missing it, so it wasn't hard to give up. And I still feel that by the middle 2000s, the beer companies came up with non alcohol beers that actually tasted pretty good. Nowadays, there are a lot of those NA beers on the market, and almost all of them taste just as good as their regular alcohol beers of the same brand. One example of capitalism actually doing a good job of recognizing a new market and doing the right thing to meet and accommodate it. But meat is going to be a much harder challenge, due to how politicized it is, and how, as you said, classism is already strongly linked to the anti meat movement.. Compared to how politicized mask wearing, vaccines, and social distancing were, during Covid, this is a matter that is more like many times more conflictual.. As for using AI, I'm a lifelong Luddite and curmadgeon, so like a lot of tech stuff, I don't trust it and resist it as much as I can, so I won't be guilty of that sin, as I don't even own a smartphone.. As for the pic of the woman's ass, you are a fellow heretic from PC, but I do draw the line of making fun of the appearance of strangers or random people, since I am far from great looking, and would rather we all be judged on our character, actions, and ideas than on our looks. But it's still fun to make fun of THE LYIN' KING's looks, and even those of MAGA, as far as I'm concerned, since for the time being, it's punching up, instead of down, since they have all the power for now..